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Question for owners of LG 55E6 (or 65E6) OLED HDTVs (Compensation Cycle Time)
TLDR: Why does other OLEDs, (including the C6 that has the same SOC), take almost 25% longer than the 55E6 to run a compensation cycle? (Times for the C6 and 2015 EF9500 are almost identical every time. Settings, firmware version has not affected this.)
Trying to determine if the big difference in time to complete a compensation cycle (CC) shown below is normal. Long story on the 55E6 - OOTB (Mar 2017) Firmware updated (via USB) to 04.30.95 OK. Noticed movie playback was very very dark. (Brightness at 60+ and Gamma 1.9 looked darker than Gamma 2.4 normally would.) He did a full TV reset, disconnect power/drain charge, etc. - didn't help. Tests at IRE 5 showed a brigher wavy border around the screen edges (evident on IRE 15 and below). His 65C6 was nothing like that even OOTB. Got a panic call asking for ideas. I asked how many hours were on the TV (if it had run a CC yet - 2016 models run a CC when turned off after 4 hours of use.) Both problems cleared up after the first CC. (Never judge an OLED until a few CC have been run. It usually helps but won't make every one a keeper.)
I wasn't there to time the first CC on the 55E6 (which obviously did something, as the panel went from horrible to good uniformity at IRE 5), but later repeated timed CC were always 6 minutes (+/- 2 seconds), where his other 2 OLED models take appx 25% longer to complete a CC cycle. (I saw one other 55E6 owner (Dec. 2017 post on AVforums and AVS) that mentioned his 55E6 CC only took 6 minutes and was also concerned about the shorter time. Replies to his post said their OLEDs took appx 7 minutes, but not sure they were timed with a stopwatch. Some just guess at almost 10 minutes.) I wish I had a Service Remote to see if the number of CC were incrementing normally on the 55E6. (Assuming CC count is incremented after completion, not at the start.)
The list below shows average Compensation Cycle (CC) times for this 55E6 is much lower than other model samples tested, which took almost 25% longer to complete. I realize there could be some variation but the average CC times for the 2015 55EF9500 and 2016 65C6 below are literally the same (considering the margin of error starting/stopping a stopwatch), despite different firmware, settings, usage, total hours used, and differences in TV/panel designs. (Although the C6 and E6 use the same SOC (IIRC) and same firmware, I wondered if the E6 difference was perhaps due to a faster processor clock speed, but not sure that is true.) Other than the one 55E6 owner, not seen any other E6 owner that had reported a consistent timed CC of only 6 minutes. (Granted most have never actually timed it - no reason to normally.)
Compensation Cycle Time to Complete
I'm curious if the much lower CC time of the 55E6 is common (for E6), or if it could indicate that the CC is not actually finishing normally. Especially interested in times from any 55E6 owners that had burn-in sooner/more easily than expected. (Again I don't have a Service Remote to check the number of completed CC.)
(Avg shown, but consistently within a few seconds. Settings didn't affect it.)
- (2016) 55E6 - 6 minutes (611 S/N - Nov. 2016 build date. FW 04.30.95 and 05.30.25)
- (2016) 65C6 - 7 minutes 22 seconds (Jan. 2017 build date. FW 05.30.02 and 05.30.25)
- (2015) 55EF9500 - 7 minutes, 23 seconds (Sept. 2015 build date. FW 4.25.60)
If you own an LG 55E6 (or 65E6), please let me know what your time to complete the CC is. (Using a stopwatch preferably, from Power Off on Remote to Red LED Off, either in Optical Port or inside rear panel (viewed looking through the top of rear vents on left side). The 701 build 65C6 doesn't seem to have the red mainboard (Power?) LED, so the Optical Audio Port red LED was used to verify when CC was finished. This required setting Audio to include Optical Out option.) I used the Red LED off to indicate end of CC, as I found the "Click" (relay) wasn't always easy to hear.
Send TV/CC Time info to news at xlr8yourmac.com and please include the build date (first 3 digits of the serial number - i.e. 611 is 2016, 11th month, 701 is 2017 1st month, etc.) and the TV firmware version if possible. (Although firmware version does not seem to be a factor to date - nor does settings values - times were consistent across FW versions, at least as of January 2018.) Thanks!
(BTW: I didn't post this in an A/V forum for several reasons. (If you frequent them you may understand why.) And I know (and have seen reports many times) that OLED TV build date has not proven to be a determining factor in banding, burn-in, etc. over the years, although rtings.com reviews of the 2017 LG OLED TVs show that Image Retention dissipates much sooner on 2017 OLED TVs than the 2016 models. (Of course there can be differences in chamber cleanliness, component parts/design changes, and clearly there are differences in panel uniformity - so much so it's called a 'panel lottery'.) Despite that, I still would like the build date info in any E6 reports. AVS had a post from an owner with burn-in on only one of his two 55E6 TVs, despite similar usage and settings. The 55E6 with spring 2016 build date had no burn-in, but the one with Nov. 2016 build date did. (The same build date as this 55E6.) I wish he had been able to check the Service Menu of the 55E6 with burn-in to see if it had the proper number of completed Compensation Cycles. (Which for 2016 models should be equal to the total power on hours divided by 4.) I saw a post in the past about a panel replacement (for severe banding IIRC) that said the repairman noted no CC appear to have completed, so no wear compensation was ever done. I can't recall if the mainboard was replaced as well.)
Of course these examples are far too small a sample size to prove anything, but after seeing the Dec. 2017 post from a 55E6 owner with the same shorter (6 minutes) CC time, I wonder if that may be related to builds from that time, although there was no mention of CC times from the owner of the two 55E6s to note if they were different. With only 2 definite timed tests of a 55E6 seen so far, I'm just curious how many other E6 owners have this shorter CC time and if that's an indication that the Compensation Cycles may not be completing fully.
I wonder if rtings' "Real Life OLED Burn In Test on 6 TVs" (Six 2017 LG C7 OLEDs) have ever checked with a Service Remote to see if all are incrementing Compensation Cycles properly. Especially if any develop major IR/burn-in sooner than expected. (I think burn-out may be a better term for what happens.) Despite the risks (with any emissive display), I'm still a fan of OLED, even with its flaws. (I wanted a 2016 as it was the last year with 3D. Passive 3D on a 4K OLED with a properly applied polarization filter is the best I've seen on a flat panel. Some owners went from 3D haters to fans.)
Why am I bothering with this if the TV seems OK so far?
I just took this 55E6 in trade (only 133 hours on it so far, but will be out of warranty soon) and would just like to know if the 6 minute CC is common for this model. (I hope to eventually get a Service Remote to at least verify if the CC count is incrementing.) There's been many owner disputes about burn-in, including some that had earlier than expected burn-in than others, even with similar usage and hours. (Including cases where some said they often watched TV stations with static logos (especially with red, yellow or gold colors), and/or gamed a lot with static icons on screen, in some cases with high OLED settings.) Those static logo/icon colors (and also high OLED settings) are a common factor, yet some claim they've not had a problem despite that. (I recall some 2016 owners that used a service remote to change the CC frequency time from every 4 hours of use to 2 hours (like 2015 models) or even 1 hour.
There's also a 1 hour CC done automatically at 2000 hours. The 2016 and later OLED TVs have a menu option to run that manually at any time - although IIRC, Sony's user manual had a note that the 1 hour CC should only be run once a year, as it could shorten the life of the panel. (Running out of adjustment/correction potential?) There's been some rare cases where the 1 hour CC made banding worse. (And some have said the normal CC effects vary - sometimes reducing banding and other times the banding looked worse.)
OLED Panel Uniformity
For the record, as far as panel vertical banding on the 3 samples above at IRE 5 (OLED setting at 45) - the (2015) 55EF9500 is the worst (appx 5" wide darker band from the right screen edge. Not as sharp an edge as some examples, but visible in uniform dark/gray scenes.) Unchanged basically since day one and still there after almost 1400 hours of use. (I'll be asking him if that improves when it runs the 1 hour CC after 2000 hours of use.) The (2016) 65C6 is much better than the EF9500, but seems to vary. The 55E6 (after the first CC) is the most uniform of the 3 (so far), but historically the 55" are often more uniform than 65" and larger panels. (Of course there's always exceptions seen at times.) At IRE 10 and above, only the 55EF9500 had any noticeable (very faint, soft edge) bands, rarely seen in content. (A common test scene for that is the horizontal pan in "Oblivion" at appx 50 minute mark. For near-black movie scene tests, there are many. One of the worst/longest I recall is the foggy boat scene near the end of "No Escape". Many fades to/from black will show it. Some movies have elevated black levels right in the banding wheelhouse so to speak. Some owners crush blacks to minimize the problem.)
The White Balance menu has a 20 point IRE Method with built-in IRE 5 to 100 screens. (Select "inner pattern" option to use them.) If the White Balance menu is not selectable, check that Energy Saving or Eye Care options are not enabled. (White Balance is not an option in modes like Standard, APS, Sports, Game, Vivid.) There's also test images (1% and up, .png or .jpg) on the web that can be put on a flash drive for use on USB ports (TV or Blu-Ray player, etc.) but I used the built-in option. (1% to 4% would look worse than IRE 5.)
Although sometimes a complaint from OLED owners, I didn't notice any objectionable tinting (yellow or red/pink, etc. tinted areas/stripes) on either of these panels. (At least in normal direct viewing, not at a severe off-center angle.) For those with a (non-uniform) screen tint, usually it's not correctable. (Unlike a white balance issue with red, green or blue levels which can be adjusted and usually are during a pro calibration.)
IR/Burn-In and Dead/Stuck Subpixel Tests (to date)
As of March 2018, none of the 3 (so far) show any persistent IR/burn-in or bad/stuck pixels. (Although low hours so far on C6 (appx 400hrs) and E6 (appx 133hrs), the 55EF9500 has almost 1400hrs.) I've seen many owners say they eventually had some subpixels fail over time (if not OOTB), but may not be noticeable at their viewing distance with a UHD screen. (Stuck ON/always lit subpixels are another story, and IIRC even 1 stuck ON may qualify for a replacement under warranty.) Full screen color slides (Red, Yellow, Green, Cyan, Magenta, White, Black) on a USB flash drive used to check for burn-in and any stuck or dead subpixels. (All 3 TVs primarily used for disc-based movie viewing, not hours of TV stations with static logos.) If you're buying a used OLED TV, make sure you test with with ALL those color slides, as often IR/burn-in may not show with colors like white or gray. (And bad subpixels may only show on a specific color.)
3D Crosstalk Tests
As far as 3D (FPR filter uniformity), the 55EF9500 seems perfect, as does the 55E6. (No crosstalk ("ghosting") seen in tests or movies.) The 65C6 tests show appx 8" wide x 4" tall areas of (slight) crosstalk at the top edge (just right of center) and bottom edge, left of center. (With viewing angle/screen adjusted as well as possible - if seated to eliminate the top C/T, bottom gets worse and V/V. Increased distance helps - currently appx 8.5 feet.) Crosstalk is very rarely seen in actual use however as most content didn't have wide separation in those areas. (I thought 3D disc menus might show C/T at bottom edge, but not noticed.) The slight curved screen makes me wonder if that's a factor - either in application/mfg or in handling as the edges (especially the top) are easily bent if not handled carefully. (Even with the 'perfect' 55", I'd rather have the 65" for 3D. Bigger is better, and 3D movies on it looked fantastic.)
(BTW: Although a SBS Black/White test image used for crosstalk tests (also useful for selecting seating position/distance to minimize crosstalk), I had noticed the 65C6's C/T areas from carefully viewing object edges during the Spears & Munsil HD Benchmark 2nd Edition disc's "Montage" 3D Video. It has various selected real-world scenes with objects at different depths/layering in various areas of the screen. (The C/T was subtle, even the owner didn't notice it.) There's also other 3D/Crosstalk tests on that disc. If you're buying a used 3D OLED TV, remember to check for crosstalk, as an incorrectly applied 3D polarization filter is not uncommon.)
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